It seems increasingly frustrating when trying to contribute accurate and good information to profiles these days.  My most recent contribution I wrote this:

"Info corrected where needed and additional info added. All taken from either the DVD cover or using programs such as DVD Shrink and DVD Decrypter. Original HQ cover scans added."

It was declined on this basis:

"An invalid source, such as a third party database, was listed in the contribution notes. Use of a third party database is not allowed per the contribution rules."

The original profile was for a "prerelease" profile which had basic and wrong information than what was really in the release.  I made the corrections, additions and made my own cover scans as I always do.

So my question is I suppose...Is using programs such as DVD Decrypter and DVD Shrink to verify information on a disc against the rules?  If so, then why and what other alternative is there to verify region code, find easter eggs, easily verify bonus material and so.  If it's not against the rules (I can't find it anywhere in the rules) then why do you suppose this was declined?

As I said, this is becoming increasingly frustrating trying to make things just perfect for whomever is doing the evaluation on any given day.  I hate to just sit around and let others do all the work and me reap the benefits of it all.  I prefer to contribute but hate over-zealous finicky people who just have to show their authority.

Any suggestions on what I can do to not get these declined?  One poster told me once that watching the movie was not a valid source for measuring aspect ratio and that the DVD cover is NOT a valid source for information.  But if it's all verified using programs, then why not?

Frick.

What, exactly, did you contribute.  I see what your notes said, but need to know what you contributed to give you an educated answer.

Quoting aka510:

Quote:
My most recent contribution I wrote this:

"Info corrected where needed and additional info added. All taken from either the DVD cover or using programs such as DVD Shrink and DVD Decrypter. Original HQ cover scans added."

From my personal point of view I would say that these notes are just a little bit too vague. You say you got info from the cover, DVD Shrink and Decrypter but it would be a lot more helpful if you actually said what info came from where.
For example here are the notes I used on a recent submission:

Quote:
Runtime checked with VLC Player. Features taken from DVD menu. Audio tracks checked with DVD decrypter. Overview taken from back cover. Cast and crew and studios as per film credits. Image scans of actual release cover.

It's not much more than what you wrote, but gives voters and screeners a much clearer idea of where the info came from.
Hope this helps.

Roles added to the cast as stated in the overview on the DVD cover

Rules violation.

The Rules specifically state to use thye film credits, exactly as they aree listed. The Cover is NOT used for this data.

Skip

Credits

Crew and Cast
Take Crew Credits from the film credits only; list names exactly as they are in the credits. Exception: If the credit information is entirely capitalized, use standard capitalization rules instead.

Use the "Credited As" field where the person's name differs from the credited name.

To determine whether to enter the name directly as credited, or to use the "Credited As" field, use the Credit Lookup tool.

Do not enter union/guild affiliations, such as A.C.E. and B.O.E.

Enter birth years only when necessary to differentate between two actors with the same name. When submitting a contribution that adds a birth year to one or more credits, list justification in the contribution notes.

Cast and crew images are not contributed with the profile.

Group names of crew members together within each role available and list in exactly the same order credited. The table below gives each of the crew roles available within DVD Profiler. For each category, include only those people credited with the roles listed in the "Film Credits to Include" column. If someone is not credited with one of these roles, do not include them in the Crew section.

Crew
Section Role Credited As Incorrect Roles Notes
Direction Director Director
Directed by Co-Director Do not include Unit Directors or Directors of Special Features
Writing Original Material By Adapted from another medium.
Screenwriter Screenwriter
Screenplay
Teleplay   Use for Adapted Screenplays
Writer Writer
Written by Used for Original Screenplays only
Based on Characters by Used for screenplays based on characters from another work, credit the author of the characters here. For example comic adaptations and sequels.
Production Producer Producer
Produced by Co-Producers
Associate Producers
Executive Producer Executive Producer Co-Executive Producer
Associate Producer
Cinematography Cinematographer Cinematographer Director of Photography
Camera Operators
Unit Photographers
Director of Photography Director of Photography Cinematographer
Camera Operators
Unit Photographers
Film Editing Film Editor Film Editor
Edited by Principal Editors listed when credited together
Music Composer Music by
Music Composed by
Score by
Score Composed by Songs by
Song/Music writers Used for the composer of the film's Original Score
Song Writer Original Songs, written specifically for the film
Sound Sound Sound
Sound Recording
Sound Recordist
Sound Supervisor
Recorded by Co-Anything
Assistants
Associates
Interns Primarily used in older films
Sound Designer Sound Designer
Sound Design
Supervising Sound Editor Supervising Sound Editor
Supervising Editor (when within the Sound section of the credits)
Sound Editor Sound Editor
Sound Re-recording Mixer Re-recording Mixer
Sound Mixing
Principal Sound Mixer
Sound Re-recording
Sound Re-recording Engineer
Sound Re-recordist
Production Sound Mixer Production Sound Mixer
Production Mixer
Location Sound Mixer
Sound Mixer (when listed outside the Sound credits)
Art Production Designer Production Designer
Art Director Supervising Art Set Decorator

Do not contribute uncredited crew members, as they can not be identified with (uncredited) as they are in the cast section. If you wish to see these uncredited crew members in your local database you can do so, but do not include them in contributions to the main database.

Cast

For the purposes of this section we define "standard" film credits as those where all credited actors involved are listed together in a single section at the end of the film - defined here as the "end credits". The section details both the actor’s Name and the Role that they played in the film. The credits may be listed "in order of appearance", "alphabetical order" or in an order of importance decided by the filmmakers. Some actors may be credited a second time in either credits at either the opening or close of the film.

For any film with standard credits, take the actor information from the end credits only, with names and roles listed exactly as they are in the credits and in exactly the same order credited.  Exception: If the credit information is entirely capitalized, use standard capitalization rules instead.

Use the "Credited As" field where the actor's name differs from the credited name.

If a film does not have standard credits, use the following rules:

    * If a film has actors listed in the opening credits, which are not listed in the end credits, add these to the list in DVD Profiler before those taken from the end credits.
    * If a film has no end credits, but does have actors credited elsewhere, enter the actors from those credits.
    * If an actor is credited by name but does not have an associated role, you may use another source to identify the role. In each case, list Actor’s names and roles (when given) exactly as they are in the credits and in exactly the same order credited.


In addition to the above, the following rules should be followed:

    * For animated films or voice-only roles, use the "Voice" checkbox.
    * If puppeteers are included in the end credits include them and append (puppeteer) at the end of the role.
    * If an actor name is only a first name or stage name enter it entirely in the first name field. Examples are Cher, Madonna, Cedric the Entertainer & Queen Latifah.
    * If an actor's credited name includes a nickname, highlighted by ", ’ or ( ), list it in the middle name field. For example John "JS" Smith, John ‘JS’ Smith or John (JS) Smith
    * Articles (such as de, de la, di, von) are entered in the appropriate name field along with the name that they precede. Use the film credits to determine whether the actor capitalizes this article or not.
    * Uncredited actors may be listed in alphabetical order following all credited actors. Use the "Uncredited" checkbox to indicate these. Uncredited actors are not required entries.
    * Do not translate foreign language role names to the language of the locality unless a translation is provided in the film credits.
    * Do not include artificial actor entries to act as separators between cast lists. (e.g. "--JAPANESE CAST--"), instead use the Divider feature for this.

Do not list actors and crew who appear only in special features, or whose scenes were deleted from the main feature, even if they appear in special features.

Do NOT use IMDb style Roman Numerals to distinguish between crew members or actors using the same name

The Rules for Cast and crew data, read them and follow them. the Contribution as you have laid it out should be DECLINED and if I saw it I would absolutely vote NO. It is your choice, but if you do not follow the Rules, then do all of us a favor and don't complain about not getting you work accepted. I have tried to be nice about it, but that is clearly not possible. So...

The reasomn for the Rules is simple, we have 500,000+ users and we tried to develop ONE PAGE from which all of us operate. If you do not want to do that, that is fine but don't think that if you chose not to follow the Rules that you should be allowed to make a mess for other users. The Online database belongs to ALL, not just ONE, you want to apply YOUR rules the place to do that is in YOUR local and ONLY your local.

BTW you wren't around when we had NO RULES only some rief guidelines and this database was a total wreck, not unlike the wreck that is IMDb.

Skip

Quoting aka510:

Quote:

...then the rules needs to be changed, that's the bottom line!

I suppose that after such an opinion, users like Skipnet50 will soon jump on you. He is VERY proud to be the father of those rules and for him it is a CRIME to say anything against them.

Quoting Skywatcher:

Quote:
So, why not help enlightening a new user instead of using the excuse to jump on another user?

I think I help this user warning what he risks. For doing the same thing, I was treated of gestapo and being a man of Vichy. Two weeks ago, I decided to block everything from Skip after he sent me a private message where he explained he had been correct to do so. Then he refused to apologize, arguing that american point of view on the subject, full of humour (and right, of course), had nothing in common with french point of view (wrong, of course). He just forgot to explain me which humour he found in a regime that helped to send thousands of innocent, including children, to gas chambers.

Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
Credits
>8 >8
Crew and Cast
If a film does not have standard credits, use the following rules:

    * If an actor is credited by name but does not have an associated role, you may use another source to identify the role . In each case, list Actor’s names and roles (when given) exactly as they are in the credits and in exactly the same order credited.
>8 >8

Skip as you so nicely quoted

and your reply:

Quote:
Roles added to the cast as stated in the overview on the DVD cover

Rules violation.

The Rules specifically state to use thye film credits, exactly as they aree listed. The Cover is NOT used for this data.

Skip

If the cast would only be credited by name and had no roles credited (mostly the case for the main cast on TV movies or series), the use of the dvd cover for the roles would no be a rule violation.