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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1... 3 4 5 6 7  Previous   Next
TV series Cover Scans
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
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I started this thread and believe the confusion was due to my inability to accurately show the community the problem.

To help clarify the matter I supplied the UPC and Disc Info to a tiny portion on the profiles that were being contributed.

The negative vote was wrong because the data change was correct even if the documentation needed clarifying/changing.

I am of the opinion that correct data is the goal and more important than any documentation.

If the data is correct I might pm the contributor to have them clarify/change their documentation. But, I would not vote "no" to correct data.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
Profiling since 2004
Registered: May 19, 2007
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Austria Posts: 5,715
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Quoting hal9g:
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Quoting AiAustria:
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Quoting hal9g:
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Quoting AiAustria:
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting AiAustria:
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For sure, the box set rules are valid for TV series too.

Incorrect, with the exception of cases with multiple seasons packaged together, which don't apply for the contributions being discussed here.

Please read the TV series chapter in the rules - from the top of the page.


You only use the boxset rules for TV Seasons when multiple seasons are bundled together AND where each season has its own UPC.


Where do you take this information from? - Not from our rule set...


Quoting from the TV Series rules:
Quote:
Note: In cases where multiple complete TV seasons/series (each with distinct UPC/EAN) are packaged together, the Box-set rules are applied, treating each season/series like a single film - applying the above rules for its individual profile.

And where do you read the fact, that the standard rules - and with them the standard box set rule - does not apply for a single TV season profiles treated with the clarifications and exceptions provided by the paragraphs above the qhoted clarification?
Complete list of Common Names  •  A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1)
 Last edited: by AiAustria
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
Profiling since 2004
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Austria Posts: 5,715
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
I started this thread and believe the confusion was due to my inability to accurately show the community the problem.

Yes, I had to download the profiles to understand the facts...
Quote:

The negative vote was wrong because the data change was correct even if the documentation needed clarifying/changing.

I am of the opinion that correct data is the goal and more important than any documentation.

If the data is correct I might pm the contributor to have them clarify/change their documentation. But, I would not vote "no" to correct data.

I agree. But often the goal is not to get the best data, but to argue - independant from the durabitlity of the facts. 
Complete list of Common Names  •  A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1)
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAddicted2DVD
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 17,334
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Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
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Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
Quoting AiAustria:
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Quoting scotthm:
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Quoting AiAustria:
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For sure, the box set rules are valid for TV series too.

Incorrect, with the exception of cases with multiple seasons packaged together, which don't apply for the contributions being discussed here.

Please read the TV series chapter in the rules - from the top of the page.


You only use the boxset rules for TV Seasons when multiple seasons are bundled together AND where each season has its own UPC.


Where do you take this information from? - Not from our rule set...


Quoting from the TV Series rules:
Quote:
Note: In cases where multiple complete TV seasons/series (each with distinct UPC/EAN) are packaged together, the Box-set rules are applied, treating each season/series like a single film - applying the above rules for its individual profile.

And where do you read the fact, that the standard rules - and with them the standard box set rule - does not apply for a single TV season profiles treated with the clarifications and exceptions provided by the paragraphs above the qhoted clarification?


There is only 3 sections to the rules... the standard rules... the box set rules... and the TV Series rules. There is no standard box set rules.

From the Rules Introduction:
Quote:
These rules apply to all kinds of profiles, but there are two special cases where the rules need clarifications. Where you see the icons shown below, refer to the special instructions at the end of this document. These are titled Movie Box sets and TV Series on DVD.
Box sets containing more than one film
TV Series on DVD

Note: The standard rules do apply for these special cases; the sections clarify specific ways the rules apply to box sets and television series on DVD.


So other then that note at the bottom of the TV Series rules... Box Set rules are completely separate from the TV series rules.
Pete
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
The negative vote was wrong because the data change was correct even if the documentation needed clarifying/changing.

How could a "no" vote be wrong if the contributor was not following the rules?  Contributing useless/misleading contribution notes is against the rules.

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If the data is correct I might pm the contributor to have them clarify/change their documentation. But, I would not vote "no" to correct data.

Besides the notes being totally incompatible with the contributions, I have explained in detail upthread why the actual TV Series Disc-Level Profile rule makes these contributions wrong.  This is not a case of voting "no" to good data just because the notes are wrong.  This is a case of people not properly reading the rules (as you admitted in your fourth post in this thread.)

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 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
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United States Posts: 3,475
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
The negative vote was wrong because the data change was correct even if the documentation needed clarifying/changing.

How could a "no" vote be wrong if the contributor was not following the rules?  Contributing useless/misleading contribution notes is against the rules.

Quote:
If the data is correct I might pm the contributor to have them clarify/change their documentation. But, I would not vote "no" to correct data.

Besides the notes being totally incompatible with the contributions, I have explained in detail upthread why the actual TV Series Disc-Level Profile rule makes these contributions wrong.  This is not a case of voting "no" to good data just because the notes are wrong.  This is a case of people not properly reading the rules (as you admitted in your fourth post in this thread.)

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I'm sorry but you are not following the rules. The child profiles were entered via Disc Id and the covers should match the parent.

Per the voting rules:

"If a user is following the Contribution Rules and his/her data is accurate, and the contribution replaces data which is inaccurate or violates these Contribution Rules, a "No" vote is considered an abuse of the voting privilege and should be avoided when possible."

Those rules do not address the documentation notes - as I stated before you might have discussed this with the contributor via a pm.

Your negative vote on correct data not only does not make sense to me, it might be considered a violation of voter rules.
 Last edited: by Kathy
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
I'm sorry but you are not following the rules. The child profiles were entered via Disc Id and the covers should match the parent.

You say that but where do The Rules say that?  I've provided text (and even screen shots) of the rules that support what I say, and you only repeat what you believe.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
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I don't know how to post pictures. But, there are other community members who have tried to show/explain to you how your argument is flawed.

On the Star Trek profiles I own, the screeners agreed with the "yes" votes and those profiles were accepted.

This has also been the case in, as far as I can remember, every single other similar contribution.

Therefore, I am done discussing this topic with you.
 Last edited: by Kathy
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting Kathy:
Quote:
there are other community members who have tried to show/explain to you how your argument is flawed.

Yes they have tried... unsuccessfully.  I was really a little surprised at how a few were unwilling to see what their eyes showed them.

Quote:
On the Star Trek profiles I own, the screeners agreed with the "yes" votes and those profiles were accepted.

Yes, as I posted above there were many contributions trying to do the same things, using the same justifications, and some were accepted by the screeners and some weren't.  That just proves that the process is flawed.  It says nothing about The Rules (nor have you, for that matter.)

Quote:
Therefore, I am done discussing this topic with you.

We may as well be.  You admit to misreading the rules but refuse to reconsider your position.  What's left to discuss?

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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
Profiling since 2004
Registered: May 19, 2007
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Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
There is only 3 sections to the rules... the standard rules... the box set rules... and the TV Series rules. There is no standard box set rules.

From the Rules Introduction:
Quote:
These rules apply to all kinds of profiles, but there are two special cases where the rules need clarifications. Where you see the icons shown below, refer to the special instructions at the end of this document. These are titled Movie Box sets and TV Series on DVD.
Box sets containing more than one film
TV Series on DVD

Note: The standard rules do apply for these special cases; the sections clarify specific ways the rules apply to box sets and television series on DVD.


So other then that note at the bottom of the TV Series rules... Box Set rules are completely separate from the TV series rules.

Yes, thank you, I missed this section.

This wording is at least open enough to interpret, that TV shows and Multiple feature box sets exclude each other.

But I still won't interpret it this way. Why? Because the other wordings don't follow this idea.
a) I gave already the example of the conditional clause, which would make no sense if the standard box set rule would not apply.
b) The same for the wording for the cast and crew section - which clarifies the second exception from the box set rules:
Quote:
In either case, the cast and crew are to be entered into the parent profile using appropriate episode dividers.

c) last not least not all categories are listed in the TV series chapter: Running time and Rating are not defined in the TV show chapter but they are to be treated equally to the feature box set (and yes, the Easter Eggs section is missing too, which I really wouldn't know how to handle - I think, I'd prefer the standard profile rule here)

But none the less the paragraph about the cover images of the disc level profile (Cover Images: If a disc, or set of discs, have their own case, use the cover images from that case) still insists of individual (differentiating) cases for subset of discs. Since the slip cover is no case type but an addition to the case type (keep case in our example) there is no individual packaging of a subset of the discs...
Complete list of Common Names  •  A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1)
 Last edited: by AiAustria
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorDJ Doena
Registered: May 1, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Yes they have tried... unsuccessfully.  I was really a little surprised at how a few were unwilling to see what their eyes showed them.


Yes. You are right and the world is wrong...




Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
But I still won't interpret it this way. Why? Because the other wordings don't follow this idea.
a) I gave already the example of the conditional clause, which would make no sense if the standard box set rule would not apply.
b) The same for the wording for the cast and crew section - which clarifies the second exception from the box set rules:
Quote:
In either case, the cast and crew are to be entered into the parent profile using appropriate episode dividers.

c) last not least not all categories are listed in the TV series chapter: Running time and Rating are not defined in the TV show chapter but they are to be treated equally to the feature box set (and yes, the Easter Eggs section is missing too, which I really wouldn't know how to handle - I think, I'd prefer the standard profile rule here)

But none the less the paragraph about the cover images of the disc level profile (Cover Images: If a disc, or set of discs, have their own case, use the cover images from that case) still insists of individual (differentiating) cases for subset of discs. Since the slip cover is no case type but an addition to the case type (keep case in our example) there is no individual packaging of a subset of the discs...


Agreed.
Karsten
DVD Collectors Online

DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting DJ Doena:
Quote:
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Yes they have tried... unsuccessfully.  I was really a little surprised at how a few were unwilling to see what their eyes showed them.

Yes. You are right and the world is wrong...

My vote was not unique, and I did say a "few", so your analogy is flawed.

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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Contributing useless/misleading contribution notes is against the rules.

Please be so kind as to show me that rule.
Quote:
This is a case of people not properly reading the rules (as you admitted in your fourth post in this thread.)

Based on everything I have read, and my understanding of the rules, it is you, not people, who is not properly reading the rules.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
 Last edited: by TheMadMartian
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
You say that but where do The Rules say that?  I've provided text (and even screen shots) of the rules that support what I say, and you only repeat what you believe.

Actually, you are only repeating what you believe as well.  The fact that you provided the text, and screen shots of the rules doesn't change that fact.  You have one interpretation, other people have a different one.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Contributing useless/misleading contribution notes is against the rules.

Please be so kind as to show me that rule.

OK.  It's the last sentence on this page:
Quote:
Contribution Notes provide an explanation of your changes to other DVD Profiler users and Invelos for voting and deciding whether to accept your contribution, so make your notes useful and descriptive.

By the way, from upthread:

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
The only time the cover on their case is different than the cover on the parent is if they are in multiple cases.

Once again, please provide me with the text of the rule that states this.


Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Actually, you are only repeating what you believe as well.  The fact that you provided the text, and screen shots of the rules doesn't change that fact.

Yes it does.  It proves that I'm posting the rules and not just what I believe is in the rules.  Some here are just posting their interpretations of imaginary rules, with nothing to back it up but their convictions.

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 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
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United States Posts: 13,202
Posted:
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Contributing useless/misleading contribution notes is against the rules.

Please be so kind as to show me that rule.

OK.  It's the last sentence on this page:
Quote:
Contribution Notes provide an explanation of your changes to other DVD Profiler users and Invelos for voting and deciding whether to accept your contribution, so make your notes useful and descriptive.

That's my bad, I quoted the wrong post...I meant to quote the one where you said, "The negative vote was correct because the Box Set rules were cited when they had no application in these cases."

That is the rule I would like you to show me.
Quote:
By the way, from upthread:

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
The only time the cover on their case is different than the cover on the parent is if they are in multiple cases.

Once again, please provide me with the text of the rule that states this.

You have already done so, so there is no reason for me to do so.
Quote:

Quoting TheMadMartian:
Quote:
Actually, you are only repeating what you believe as well.  The fact that you provided the text, and screen shots of the rules doesn't change that fact.

Yes it does.  It proves that I'm posting the rules and not just what I believe is in the rules.  Some here are just posting their interpretations of imaginary rules, with nothing to back it up but their convictions.

I'm sorry, but no.  While you are posting the actual rule, ignoring the slip case for the child profiles is just your interpretation of that rule.  The rest of us are doing the exact same thing...posting our interpretation of the rule you keep quoting.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
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