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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting northbloke: Quote:
And where exacty in the credit does the word "some" appear? That is your assumption.
That credit tells me that they wrote the words and the music to a musical play. Not "some" of them. The word 'some' means an unspecified quantity or number. I don't know how much of the musical they wrote, I only know that they wrote some words and some music. Quote:
Do you or do you not accept that Tim Rice and Andrew Lloyd Webber are credited with the creation of all or part of the musical play, Evita? Based on that credit? No, I do not accept that. Quote:
Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice are credited with the creation of all or part of that "other medium", therefore they get an OMB credit. No, they are credited with writing music and lyrics for that medium. Elton John wrote words an music for the Lion King. That doesn't mean he wrote part of that film. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting m.cellophane: Quote:
Where does the credit chart or program require that? The program allows credit for a song. This is enough. The credit doesn't have to say anything that you require. True enough, but the credit doesn't say the film is based on a song. It says it is based on a play called 'Evita'. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting 8ballMax: Quote:
This has gone on long enough! Four pages...going on 5 and it's the same thing all over again
Why are you wasting time here with a couple of stonewalling users who have no intention of changing their minds? Submit the OMB credit for TW and ALW and be done with it for cry'n out loud. Let the screener's do their job  . If they decide the credit is unwarranted then so be it. Just remember this the next time you are 'stonewalling' about a credit you don't like.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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| Registered: June 3, 2007 | | Posts: 333 |
| | Posted: | | | | This is straightforward.
Despite the fact that it's a loose adaption of actual events, Evita the musical was written by Andrew Llloyd Webber and Tim Rice. The movie is an adaption of the musical. They get OMB credits.
Type it, submit it and forget it. | | | | Last edited: by Snark |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting m.cellophane: Quote:
Quoting Unicus69:
Quote:
Quoting m.cellophane:
Quote:
Quoting Unicus69:
Quote:
All the 'Evita' credits tell us is that the movie was based on the musical and that two people wrote music and lyrics for that musical. It does not say that they wrote the entire musical.
And what requires us to know that someone wrote the entire musical before we grant them an OMB?
Nothing. But the credit has to say that they did, in fact, write the musical that the film is based on. This credit does not do that.
Where does the credit chart or program require that? The program allows credit for a song. This is enough. The credit doesn't have to say anything that you require. I've already stated that I understand why you would want to give them an OMB credit, but as I interpret the credit, I wouldn't do it because it is not clear, solely from the credit, that these two gentlemen are the authors of the "play". The credit in the film is not for a song or songs in the play, but for the play itself. Now I'm done. | | | | Hal |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 1,819 |
| | Posted: | | | | I am a collector of musicals and to date I have 4 versions of Sweeney Todd and 4 versions of Evita.
I have looked at all of them.
Evita: Nowhere across the 4 versions is anyone credited as having written the 'book' for the play. This is largely due to the fact that Evita is entirely sung. Given that it IS entirely sung the 'writers' of the play are, indeed, Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice.
Sweeney Todd: Only ONE of my 4 versions is Hugh Wheeler mentioned for having written the Book. He gets the 'Book by' credit which is common in musical theatre.
I personally do NOT have ALW and TR credited as OMB in my copy of the film - however, I can see that I probably should have.
I would also agree that the onscreen credit for Evita does NOT preclude them from being listed.
The only reason the credit is worded as 'music and lyrics by' is because that is how they were originally credited when Evita was first released as a studio concept album. In effect they have stayed true to the original credit.
To those that want the OMB credit. Submit it and see.
Also - be thankful that they wrote 'You Must Love Me' for the film; otherwise if you stuck to the rules ALW & TR would not get a music credit at all as they wouldn't have written any original music for the film.
And,....to those of you with Sweeney Todd - I bet you have Sondheim listed in your music sections! Even though no new matierial was written for the film.
The reason being is that the rules do not take into account musicals and the fact that it would be completely dumb to omit the composer/lyricist of a musical simply because no new material had been written. | | | | Last edited: by Pantheon |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,819 |
| | Posted: | | | | Also, I should like to add that I see no difference between researching theatre credits to be able to add them or researching the different crew listings in different countries (Dubbing mixer etc).
Here of some examples of musicals I have personally seen:
Secret Garden
Book and Lyrics by Marsha Norman
Music by Lucy Simon
(There IS dialogue in the musical).
Starlight Express
Music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
Lyrics by Richard Stilgoe
(There is NO dialogue in the musical)
Aspects of Love
Music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
Lyrics by Don Black & Charles Hart
Based on the novel by David Garnett
Book adaptation by Andrew Lloyd Webber
(There IS dialogue)
Joseph and the Amazing Technicolour Dreamcoat
Lyrics by Tim Rice
Music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
(NO dialogue)
Jesus Christ Superstar
Lyrics by Tim Rice
Music by Andrew Lloyd Webber
(NO dialogue)
Les Misérables
Music by Claude Michel Shonberg and Alain Boubil
Lyrics by Herbert Kretzmer
Based on the novel by Victor Hugo
(NO dialogue).
I could go on and on with examples.
Suffice to say that with musicals the absence of a 'book by' credit means that the musical is entirely sung and therefore written by the composer and lyricist. | | | | Last edited: by Pantheon |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
As another example, if the credit were:
'Based on the book by J.R.R. Tolkien and Illustrated by John Doe'
Would you give both J.R.R. Tolkien and John Doe a OMB credit?
I certainly would not. I would. |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,692 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting northbloke: Quote:
Quoting 8ballMax:
Quote:
This has gone on long enough! Four pages...going on 5 and it's the same thing all over again
Why are you wasting time here with a couple of stonewalling users who have no intention of changing their minds? Submit the OMB credit for TW and ALW and be done with it for cry'n out loud. Let the screener's do their job . If they decide the credit is unwarranted then so be it.
First sensible thing I've read all night. I'm away to bed now...   just submit the change. You should know by now that common sense isn't allowed unless it was specified in the Rules. | | | | Paul |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 1,242 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting pauls42: Quote:
You should know by now that common sense isn't allowed unless it was specified in the Rules. Is that a SD, BD or HD version?????  Steve |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Pantheon: Quote:
And,....to those of you with Sweeney Todd - I bet you have Sondheim listed in your music sections! Even though no new matierial was written for the film.
The reason being is that the rules do not take into account musicals and the fact that it would be completely dumb to omit the composer/lyricist of a musical simply because no new material had been written. No, he is listed in the music section because the film gives him a credit that is valid in Profiler. The credit reads, "Music and Lyrics by Stephen Sondheim." "Music by" is in the credit chart. Had the credit listed indivisual songs written by Stephen Sondheim, that were taken exactly from the musical, he would not have gotten a credit as they would not have been written for the film. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting pauls42: Quote:
You should know by now that common sense isn't allowed unless it was specified in the Rules. That might be because common sense isn't common. What is common sense to you may not be common sense to someone else. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 1,777 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Quoting pauls42:
Quote:
You should know by now that common sense isn't allowed unless it was specified in the Rules.
That might be because common sense isn't common. What is common sense to you may not be common sense to someone else. God knows we see plenty of examples of that on a daily basis. | | | | Last edited: by mdnitoil |
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