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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Looking for some examples... |
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| Registered: March 15, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
And oh yes, it WILL create a major mess. I can't help it if you can't or won't (more likely) saee it but it will a year from now make the database virtually useless to all of us.
Skip <shake head incredulously) You keep saying this, but you're yet to explain how. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | I have tried, north, you don't understand it and I am out of ideas on how to explain it to you.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | No, it's you who either doesn't or won't understand it.
Simple question:
FRANCOIS = Francois according to whose rules? |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | The ONLY thin I can think of, is go study IMDb where they allow their users to run rampant and adhere to whatever each user(or region) wants to do and look closely at their mess. Accurate data according to what SINGLE yardstick I have never figured out, they seem have many different yardsticks. I provided ONE single yardstick, and I have said repeatedly it is not about ANY culture it is about the credits On Screen, that IS the culture that decides what we enter not some mysterious hocus pocus. Type what you see, not what you hallucinate into existence.
Can you tell my frustration level is building.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
I provided ONE single yardstick That's the problem - you didn't. The rules tell us to use "standard capitalisation rules" but they never tell us whose. You ASSUMED that everyone would follow US standard capitalisation rules, but they didn't, they used their own. You didn't provide one yardstick - you provided multiple yardsticks and that's why we're in the mess we're in. Gerri has now chosen a yardstick - it's just not the one you wanted her to choose. | | | | Last edited: by northbloke |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | I have told you REPEATEDLY for three years, have you listened NO. This is not a new discussion. What do I get for my troubles, north, insults, demeaning comments and users who think they know more about the Rules than i do. Have you one time, despite the fact that I have repeatedly described what was in my mind and even explained that a lot of what you see as problems got lost in the cut down process, said Ok Skip explain what you were trying to achieve here...NO, not once, But it has been explained nontheless. Why should i not get testy and frustrated, north. You reason is simply this, because you want it that way, it is not based on anything even remotely connected to data.
I have even said numerous times had I the power to edit the rules, I would have cleared most of our issues up in very short order, but that i can't do, ALL I can do is try to provide some form of guidance, and no I won't try to provide any kind of guidance on things that I had nothing to do with such as slip case/slip cover, or the famous possessive argument, which I still believe is wrong. I had nothing to do with them or their implementation so I can't offer any guidance and won't
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | Sorry Skip but you know as well as everyone else, unless it's in the rules or it's confirmed by Ken or Gerri, that forum posts mean nothing.
If you'd wanted people to follow US standard capitalisation rules, you should have had it put in the rules simple as that.
Like it or not, you're a user like the rest of us. Irrespective of your involvement in the rules, you have no more or less authority than anyone else on here. You may have told us repeatedly, but until it's in the rules, it's not a rule.
You yourself have stated that forum posts and polls mean nothing until verified by Invelos - why should your posts be any different? |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Spin spin all you are doing is validating everything i have said. Why do i even bother? If you sniff the air you might be able to smell wood burning, north, I won't say what I am REALLY thinking.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: May 8, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,945 |
| | Posted: | | | | I think you 2 should smoke some pot and chill down a bit  Donnie | | | | www.tvmaze.com |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,917 |
| | Posted: | | | | And get some snacks. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 810 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
The ONLY thin I can think of, is go study IMDb where they allow their users to run rampant and adhere to whatever each user(or region) wants to do and look closely at their mess. Accurate data according to what SINGLE yardstick I have never figured out, they seem have many different yardsticks. I provided ONE single yardstick, and I have said repeatedly it is not about ANY culture it is about the credits On Screen, that IS the culture that decides what we enter not some mysterious hocus pocus. Type what you see, not what you hallucinate into existence.
Can you tell my frustration level is building.
Skip Skip you claim over and over that "it is not about ANY culture it is about the credits On Screen", but the funny shapes on the screen need culture to turn them into meaning! You say that "JOE", "JOe", "Joe" and "joe" all mean the same thing, but we need rules (from our culture) to know that. From a pure ASCII code standpoint "J" is not equal to "j", let alone "E", "e", "é" and "è". We need rules to know if they are the same or not. I have films in my collection in more then twenty languages, each with its our rules about upper and lower case. Many of them use the same rules that we use in US English, but many do not. This whole thing is not about you or your database, it is about us and our database (as controlled and hosted by the Coles and Invelos). We need rules that work for all of us and our DVDs. pdf | | | Paul Francis
San Juan Capistrano, CA, USA | | | | Last edited: by pdf256 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Unicus:
I have several thousand edited titles under my belt, I think I know whether it works in practice or not and it absolutely does. This really about users, not paying attention to the data itself, they simply to break the foundation that was laid and impose their culture upon everybody. Yes, their Contributions do affect everybody, that is why I voted NO to north, his change affects the fundamentals of the database.
(...)
Based on your reply, I can only guess you misunderstood what I was talking about. I was NOT talking about the rules. You said, "As I have noted, EVERYONE who works on a film has a contract and that contract dictates how François is to be credited, if he is fine with FRANCOIS or Francois, we are too." That is the part I was talking about. In theory, what the actor's contract states is supposed to go in the credits, goes in the credits. In practice, however, it isn't always the case. I hope that clears up this little misunderstanding.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting pdf256: Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
The ONLY thin I can think of, is go study IMDb where they allow their users to run rampant and adhere to whatever each user(or region) wants to do and look closely at their mess. Accurate data according to what SINGLE yardstick I have never figured out, they seem have many different yardsticks. I provided ONE single yardstick, and I have said repeatedly it is not about ANY culture it is about the credits On Screen, that IS the culture that decides what we enter not some mysterious hocus pocus. Type what you see, not what you hallucinate into existence.
Can you tell my frustration level is building.
Skip
Skip you claim over and over that "it is not about ANY culture it is about the credits On Screen", but the funny shapes on the screen need culture to turn them into meaning! You say that "JOE", "JOe", "Joe" and "joe" all mean the same thing, but we need rules (from our culture) to know that. From a pure ASCII code standpoint "J" is not equal to "j", let alone "E", "e", "é" and "è". We need rules to know if they are the same or not.
I have films in my collection in more then twenty languages, each with its our rules about upper and lower case. Many of them use the same rules that we use in US English, but many do not.
This whole thing is not about you or your database, it is about us and our database (as controlled and hosted by the Coles and Invelos). We need rules that work for all of us and our DVDs.
pdf What an insane comment? I am totally speechless. If you pay attention the system as designed will work for EVERY user in every culture EVERYWHERE. But as is typical for Paul, he absolutely, and you dare not comprehend or even show the slightest degree of agreement.. You are unbelievable. It is the argument that you support that make the database valueless and workable for some but NOT for EVERYONE. Skip  | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 3,830 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting northbloke: Quote:
The problem is we are not dealing with what we see on screen - we have to change the data into lower case information. That's the rules. If you wanted to deal with pure data you should have kept it all in upper case.
As soon as you start to convert data into another format you start to complicate things and apply assumptions to that data. Whether you'll ever admit it or not, converting FRANCOIS to Francois is an assumption.
Originally the rules only told us to use "standard capitalisation rules", however this did not take into account that each language has it's own rules and nobody knew whose to use, so they were all using their own. That was causing disruption in the database.
The fact that Gerri has now clarified whose rules we follow (those of the country the person comes from) has actually created order and a defined path we can all follow. This will create unity in the database, not the mess you predict. That still leaves you with the problem even in France you find people where FRANCOIS = Francois (First Name or Last Name) you can't realy stick a linguistic rule to the name convention for one reason or another. | | | | Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | All too true, Giga, which is yet another reason to use the CA instead of blowing up the foundation of the program for the benefit of the culturalists. The CA system will very nicely handle this aspect of data with documentation. I am astounded that my position takes recognition of the issue and seeks to provide a solution that wWILL serve ALL users ALL of the time. While the position of Paul and his fellow culturalists are not interested in ANY kind of a compromise...which makes me wonder what the REAL objective is here...I think I know the answer...BUT I will keep it to myself...I have believed it for a long time and I am not happy about it. I also won't describe the image that the culturalists paint for me with their outrageous position.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 3,830 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | | Sources for one or more of the changes and/or additions were not submitted. Please include the sources for your changes in the contribution notes, especially for cast and crew additions. |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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