Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
If there is no documentation, Tim A/B/C is the starting point, three names, three fields.

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending how you look at it - I'm not even gonna pick a side at this point), that is nowhere in the rules. And as such, profiles all over the world use different parsing for the same names. While you have your way to handle these, the next user in, say, Italy will have his own way to handle these - that's often based on the field names: for many people, the fact that the fields are called "first name", "middle name" and "last name" doesn't really match with the "everything between the first and last words belongs in the 'middle'" theory. Sure, that may stem from a different cultural background, but my problem is this:

If I share certain profiles with the same actor with both you and that Italian user - how do I get them linked up? I know it's no problem in my local database, but I want to get the online database in order, too. I can't persuade you to accept that Italian's method of parsing, and I can't persuade him of your method. I can't point either of you to the rules, because they have nothing to say on the matter. You say: "A/B/C is the starting point, three names, three fields", while someone else will say: if it's not a "middle name", I won't enter it into the "middle name" field. If nothing changes, we'll be stuck forever with those non-linking double entries for each and every name consisting of more than two parts.

Again: I certainly understand your point of view, but I feel we really need to get all all users, accross the various regions and localities, on the same page. Based on my experiences so far, I'm pretty sure that won't happen as long as Invelos doesn't offer any clear guidance on this in the rules. Or maybe we need a pinned "correctly parsed names" thread, similar to the one with birth years...?

Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
If there is no documentation, Tim A/B/C is the starting point, three names, three fields.

Skip

Words are not names.
Use the fields according to their label!

Quoting RHo:

Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
If there is no documentation, Tim A/B/C is the starting point, three names, three fields.

Skip

Words are not names.
Use the fields according to their label!

But how is anybody supposed to know when a word isn't the name? The only simple way is to say just that -
        1st word = 1st name
        last word = last name
        all the rest = middle name

If everybody starts from that and only change this when it's documented then we have less chance of constant changes to names.

Of course if we could just have a single field for name then this thread would be only 5 -6 pages long.. 

Quoting goblinsdoitall:

Quote:
Hi everybody.
Did anyone realize that bbbbb didn't even give us the name of the actor, just a fragment.

Yes, I did!

Quote:
Possibly this is just another of "These" discussions that he loves to start.

Possibly bbbbb's interest was not so much the result of a correct parsing of one single example,
but in trying to understand the underlying concept.

If we proceed on this assumption, bbbbb very probably loved "The" discussion he started and will now
be satisfied, and grateful for each and every patient explanation.

Hmmmmmmm

                 

Skip

Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
Rho: The best way is a simple starting point instead of going through your little 6tap dance which as often as not will lead to totally erroneous entries without documentation to bacj k up your GUESS. ALKL IT IS is a place to start , rho, obviously you have a problem with that concept, so what.

Skip

Me and other people have a problem with counting words instead of parsing a name. Word counting is nowhere supported or demanded, not by the rules, nor by the program, nor by any voice of Invelos (Ken or Geri).

I do raise my dislike to enter the middle word of a three word name into the middle name field in the case when I have a strong suspicion that the middle word is actually part of the last name without being able to prove it. Can I be wrong on my suspicion: yes of course. Would word counting give the better result: no, I don't think so.

Of course if I do not have any suspicion (or even better I may have the suspicion that the second word is indeed a second given name), I have no problem at all entering this word into the middle name field.

Would I change an existing a/b/c parsing into a//b c without documentation: no, of course not.
Would I accept it that you change an existing parsing from a//b c without any documentation except that a/b/c is better: of course not.

Indeed, so what.

Quoting RHo:

Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:

Quote:
Rho: The best way is a simple starting point instead of going through your little 6tap dance which as often as not will lead to totally erroneous entries without documentation to bacj k up your GUESS. ALKL IT IS is a place to start , rho, obviously you have a problem with that concept, so what.

Skip

Me and other people have a problem with counting words instead of parsing a name. Word counting is nowhere supported or demanded, not by the rules, nor by the program, nor by any voice of Invelos (Ken or Geri).

I do raise my dislike to enter the middle word of a three word name into the middle name field in the case when I have a strong suspicion that the middle word is actually part of the last name without being able to prove it. Can I be wrong on my suspicion: yes of course. Would word counting give the better result: no, I don't think so.

Of course if I do not have any suspicion (or even better I may have the suspicion that the second word is indeed a second given name), I have no problem at all entering this word into the middle name field.

Would I change an existing a/b/c parsing into a//b c without documentation: no, of course not.
Would I accept it that you change an existing parsing from a//b c without any documentation except that a/b/c is better: of course not.

Indeed, so what.

If it is such a big deal to you to parse names according to your "suspicions" well by all means go ahead and do it that way when you contribute a new cast/crew list.  Just don't be surprised if people vote against your particular way of parsing a name.  If you include in your notes that you think this is the way the name should be parsed you may or may not cut down on the number of NO votes you might otherwise get.  I don't see where it's such a big deal to use A/B/C when you don't know what the correct parsing is.  But if you have a problem with it, do it as you like and accept the consequences.  There's nothing in the rules about parsing names, so it is all very much a subjective argument -- one which is hardly worth all these pages in the thread.

Quoting T!M:
[...]

Quote:

Again: I certainly understand your point of view, but I feel we really need to get all all users, accross the various regions and localities, on the same page. Based on my experiences so far, I'm pretty sure that won't happen as long as Invelos doesn't offer any clear guidance on this in the rules. Or maybe we need a pinned "correctly parsed names" thread, similar to the one with birth years...?

As guidance, I would say:

if you don't have a clue, use A/B/C as a general starting point, unless documented otherwise, as follows:

Documentation: since there is not much documentation on name parsing, and a definitive proof is often impossible to find either way, documentation which shows the most likely parsing will suffice;

Foreign Cast & Crew: if it's a foreign (non-US) production, or there are foreign Cast & Crew members anyway, you are allowed to use local parsing rules according to their origin/nationality;

I hope that these guide lines would make everybody happy.