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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Episode Numbering in Dividers |
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Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,436 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: OR until you say, you know he's got a point here. God forbid that should happen. If I see your point, I will say so. I know, however, that this is a community and that the majority should prevail. A concept you occasionally overlook or refuse to acknowledge. You have made your concerns heard, yet still the vote (currently) leans towards a standard... | | | Achim [諾亞信; Ya-Shin//Nuo], a German in Taiwan. Registered: May 29, 2000 (at InterVocative) |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 951 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: I can't wait to grab my next TV season to set it up. I KNOW now that I have said I have not seen Roman Numerals or Alpha characters, the next one I pick up will use one of them.
Skip Go for it... I don't think anyone would stop you. As of now I haven't voted No on any contribution that didn't use the "1. Episode Name" format. I'll give you one you can work on "Wonder Woman" Series. The menus use "1) Episode Title" format and the DVD case uses "Episode 1: Episode Title" format. Both would be as credited so I guess it's up the the contributor which one should use. When I originally contributed this series I used the results of the last poll so they are currently in the "1. Episode Title" format. | | | Are you local? This is a local shop the strangers you would bring would not understand us, our customs, our local ways. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 951 |
| Posted: | | | | Here's another one if you own the X-Files seasons they use "1x01 Episode Title" format on the DVD cover. The DVD menus just list the episode titles no numbers at least for season 1, they might change for the other seasons. | | | Are you local? This is a local shop the strangers you would bring would not understand us, our customs, our local ways. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Fortunately...I don't have either of those....yet.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 21, 2007 | Posts: 20 |
| Posted: | | | | Deviating from what is used on the disc (menu) itself can cause confusion and decrease the quality of the data. A specific example: Star Trek:TOS Season 1 Disc 1. The on screen menu lists the episodes like this: (it's production order numbering while the episodes are physically in airdate order) 06 The Man Trap 08 Charlie X 02 Where No Man Has Gone Before 07 The Naked Time
Under Choice A the dividers (and presumably the Overview episode list) would artificially change to look like this: 1 The Man Trap 2 Charlie X 3 Where No Man Has Gone Before 4 The Naked Time
You've just made matching database info to disc information more difficult. And what does an artificial "start at 1" (or 1-1) mean anyway? The first broadcast episode? the first production episode? the first episode on the disc (in which case you would start back at 1 even on a second disc of the same season)? Theoretically 3 different episodes could have the number 1 (or 1-1).
If there is no numbering present, then by all means have a standard. But if there is already an "official" episode numbering scheme for a series used on the DVD then it should be used-that is the best way to keep information on a specific episode always correctly connected to it's number.
Chris |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 742 |
| Posted: | | | | I don't see the problem. It seems that the DVD in this case combines two order lists into one.
Well, for profiling purposes, we don't need two, one is completely enough.
So, take a look at the DVD (not the menu): If you're watching the episodes, in what order do they play? THAT's the order you're supposed to enter.
What's being discussed here is merely the format you use to enter this data, i. e. do you take the same numbering accross the board or do we make ourselves dependent on Hollywood's marketing departments once again?
BTW, what are you going to do with foreigen (especially Asian) TV-sets? You have to change the episode listings on those if the use Asian scripture as it can't be reproduced in DVDP. In those cases, you have to fall back on a predetermined standard anyway.
For the sake of consistency (that word ring a bell with some posting here?), ease of data entry, and understandability of rules to people NOT following the forums and especially the discusssions in the rules committee forum, I am positive that a standardized form of profiling episode lists is preferrable.
And using whatever is on the box (btw., anybody of those in support of option B care to explain which way you'll go if on screen menu and / or outer box and / or inlay differ in the way of numbering?) is not a standardized way of entering, it's merely a standard of where to take the data from. It will lead to inconsistent data entries if you compare episode lists of different shows. | | | Lutz |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 2,759 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote: My problem with the first choice is that it is in direct conflict with the Rules. Which says in the Introduction
"The authoritative source for information submitted should be the DVD itself. " There's no conflict with the rules. The information is still coming from the DVD itself. We would just apply some standard formating the same way we do it to other part of the data (title capitalisation, italics in overview, leaving out Inc. from studios, dropping guildes from crew etc.) |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 467 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Darxon: Quote: I don't see the problem. It seems that the DVD in this case combines two order lists into one.
Well, for profiling purposes, we don't need two, one is completely enough.
So, take a look at the DVD (not the menu): If you're watching the episodes, in what order do they play? THAT's the order you're supposed to enter.
What's being discussed here is merely the format you use to enter this data, i. e. do you take the same numbering accross the board or do we make ourselves dependent on Hollywood's marketing departments once again?
BTW, what are you going to do with foreigen (especially Asian) TV-sets? You have to change the episode listings on those if the use Asian scripture as it can't be reproduced in DVDP. In those cases, you have to fall back on a predetermined standard anyway.
For the sake of consistency (that word ring a bell with some posting here?), ease of data entry, and understandability of rules to people NOT following the forums and especially the discusssions in the rules committee forum, I am positive that a standardized form of profiling episode lists is preferrable.
And using whatever is on the box (btw., anybody of those in support of option B care to explain which way you'll go if on screen menu and / or outer box and / or inlay differ in the way of numbering?) is not a standardized way of entering, it's merely a standard of where to take the data from. It will lead to inconsistent data entries if you compare episode lists of different shows. I would use the DVD menu. I have done this with every one of my TV-shows. And those that aren't numbered on the DVD menu (Like MacGyver Season one) I leave unumbered. I don't see any point to create artificial data. I voted for option B, but the poll is irrelevant because it haven't one option as credited. Please make a new poll, with all options this time. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 465 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting pompel9: Quote: I would use the DVD menu. I have done this with every one of my TV-shows. And those that aren't numbered on the DVD menu (Like MacGyver Season one) I leave unumbered. I don't see any point to create artificial data. I voted for option B, but the poll is irrelevant because it haven't one option as credited. Please make a new poll, with all options this time. You had your chance in this poll we already had about his topic (you should have voted "Other" and explained it). Even this thread here is already completely superfluous (I have a hard time refraining from writing some other comments about it, concerning some rules committee members constantly undermining forum decisions about this topic and trying to impose their own will on the rules - with this new vote here being the latest effort). We have had more than enough votes now, the users' opinion is crystal clear: There will be a standard for numbering in the dividers and it will include numbering episodes sequentially in the order that they appear on the DVD(s) in the set. Period. After months of discussion there is a reasonable proposal available in the rules committee forum, and I hope this vote here is the last interference before it can be sent to Ken for final approval. | | | Michael | | | Last edited: by TigiHof |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 6,635 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting TigiHof: Quote: Quoting pompel9:
Quote: I would use the DVD menu. I have done this with every one of my TV-shows. And those that aren't numbered on the DVD menu (Like MacGyver Season one) I leave unumbered. I don't see any point to create artificial data. I voted for option B, but the poll is irrelevant because it haven't one option as credited. Please make a new poll, with all options this time. You had your chance in this poll we already had about his topic (you should have voted "Other" and explained it).
Even this thread here is already completely superfluous (I have a hard time refraining from writing some other comments about it, concerning some rules committee members constantly undermining forum decisions about this topic and trying to impose their own will on the rules - with this new vote here being the latest effort).
We have had more than enough votes now, the users' opinion is crystal clear: There will be a standard for numbering in the dividers and it will include numbering episodes sequentially in the order that they appear on the DVD(s) in the set. Period.
After months of discussion there is a reasonable proposal available in the rules committee forum, and I hope this vote here is the last interference before it can be sent to Ken for final approval. Unfortunately, this is the nature of an "open" forum on the Rules. You might as well just get used to it. | | | Hal |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | I must admit I am a little surprised that at this moment option A is now double option B. not surprised that option took the lead mind you... just thought it would stay much closer. | | | Pete |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 2,694 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting pompel9: Quote: Quoting Darxon:
Quote: I don't see the problem. It seems that the DVD in this case combines two order lists into one.
Well, for profiling purposes, we don't need two, one is completely enough.
So, take a look at the DVD (not the menu): If you're watching the episodes, in what order do they play? THAT's the order you're supposed to enter.
What's being discussed here is merely the format you use to enter this data, i. e. do you take the same numbering accross the board or do we make ourselves dependent on Hollywood's marketing departments once again?
BTW, what are you going to do with foreigen (especially Asian) TV-sets? You have to change the episode listings on those if the use Asian scripture as it can't be reproduced in DVDP. In those cases, you have to fall back on a predetermined standard anyway.
For the sake of consistency (that word ring a bell with some posting here?), ease of data entry, and understandability of rules to people NOT following the forums and especially the discusssions in the rules committee forum, I am positive that a standardized form of profiling episode lists is preferrable.
And using whatever is on the box (btw., anybody of those in support of option B care to explain which way you'll go if on screen menu and / or outer box and / or inlay differ in the way of numbering?) is not a standardized way of entering, it's merely a standard of where to take the data from. It will lead to inconsistent data entries if you compare episode lists of different shows.
I would use the DVD menu. I have done this with every one of my TV-shows. And those that aren't numbered on the DVD menu (Like MacGyver Season one) I leave unumbered. I don't see any point to create artificial data. I voted for option B, but the poll is irrelevant because it haven't one option as credited. Please make a new poll, with all options this time. What we're really talking about here is formatting. It is not only common practice in databases to set formatting standards, it is a necessity so that people from vastly different backgrounds all see the data the same way, and can discuss it easily because everybody knows what to look at. Is it arbitrary, you bet. But, like I've already said, we've had this discussion five times already and came to a concensus that the majority accepted last time around. You can still set it up in your local any way you wish to. Enough already. | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964 Make America Great Again! | | | Last edited: by Rifter |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 465 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote: Unfortunately, this is the nature of an "open" forum on the Rules.
You might as well just get used to it. Hal, I'm one of those in the rules committee who do respect the open forum, that's why I'm so upset about others who do not share the same attitude. Everything that had to be decided for the new TV Series Cast&Crew rule was already decided by the community. You are a committee member as well as I am and you have read the discussion threads there. There are some users who constantly try to impose their will on he rules despite how the votes went. This discussion has been dragging on for weeks now, maybe even months (to me it feels like years ) and there comes the point when you have to wrap up something and be done with it. I'm just afraid that even this poll won't be the end of it... | | | Michael |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 17,334 |
| Posted: | | | | Lets hope it is settled now. because between the 2 polls (and yes I do see a difference between the 2) It has been perfectly clear on both how it needs to be handled in the rules. At least for this revision of the rules. | | | Pete |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting TigiHof: Quote: Quoting hal9g:
Quote: Unfortunately, this is the nature of an "open" forum on the Rules.
You might as well just get used to it. Hal, I'm one of those in the rules committee who do respect the open forum, that's why I'm so upset about others who do not share the same attitude. Everything that had to be decided for the new TV Series Cast&Crew rule was already decided by the community. You are a committee member as well as I am and you have read the discussion threads there. There are some users who constantly try to impose their will on he rules despite how the votes went.
This discussion has been dragging on for weeks now, maybe even months (to me it feels like years ) and there comes the point when you have to wrap up something and be done with it. I'm just afraid that even this poll won't be the end of it... If you truly respect the open forum, then you have to respect each member of that forum. Someone brought up this issue so it had to be discussed. As Hal said, that is the nature of an open forum on the 'rules'. You complain about other people trying to impose their will while, at the same time, you are trying to impose your own by squashing a discussion simply because you feel the discussion should be over. I am sorry but, if something comes up, that wasn't thought of before, it has to be discussed. It is much better to hash all these things out BEFORE they get into the rules, not after. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,911 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote:
What we're really talking about here is formatting. It is not only common practice in databases to set formatting standards, it is a necessity so that people from vastly different backgrounds all see the data the same way, and can discuss it easily because everybody knows what to look at. Is it arbitrary, you bet. But, like I've already said, we've had this discussion five times already and came to a concensus that the majority accepted last time around. You can still set it up in your local any way you wish to. Enough already. I agree 110% with what John has said. | | | Signature banned: Reason out of date... |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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