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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Bend the River About formats |
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| Registered: March 15, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | There's a difference between submitting data from a 3rd party database and referring to data from a 3rd party database. It's a very slight difference, and unfortunately very hard to explain too!  But it is there, and referring to 3rd party data is allowed. I'll try and give an example: You want to give an actor a role name, but the film credits don't list one. THIS IS NOT ALLOWED - You go to a 3rd party database and it lists one, so you use it and submit it. THIS IS ALLOWED - You search a variety of 3rd party databases, and they all agree on the same name. You use it and submit it. It's a bit oversimplifying the thing, but that's generally the idea. One source bad, many sources good. |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting northbloke: Quote:
There's a difference between submitting data from a 3rd party database and referring to data from a 3rd party database. It's a very slight difference, and unfortunately very hard to explain too!
But it is there, and referring to 3rd party data is allowed.
I'll try and give an example:
You want to give an actor a role name, but the film credits don't list one.
THIS IS NOT ALLOWED - You go to a 3rd party database and it lists one, so you use it and submit it.
THIS IS ALLOWED - You search a variety of 3rd party databases, and they all agree on the same name. You use it and submit it.
It's a bit oversimplifying the thing, but that's generally the idea. One source bad, many sources good. Isn't this an interpretation of the rules? I've read the text I mentionned, which says "only from the DVD; Nothing from third party db" Please can you show me exactly where in the contribution rules what you say is written? I've not seen that, but I probably missed it. I've been flamed because I didn't want to follow EXACTLY the rules , even if they were stupid. So I need to see exactly what is written in the rules (not in the forum) concerning this subject. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | No, I don't think that it's an interpretation.
The rule says "don't submit content from a third party database" - this means you are not allowed to copy data directly from a single 3rd party source. The rule says "database" singular, not "databases" plural. Nor does it say "any 3rd party database". The rule says you are not allowed to use any single source for your data.
If a number of 3rd party sources all agree on the same piece of data. Then you are allowed to use this data, quoting the sources to show that there has been a concensus.
You have to remember that there are some pieces of information that can only come from 3rd party sources (uncredited cast, SRPs etc.) so if we banned them outright we'd have a lot less info on the profiles. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting northbloke:
Quote:
There's a difference between submitting data from a 3rd party database and referring to data from a 3rd party database. It's a very slight difference, and unfortunately very hard to explain too!
But it is there, and referring to 3rd party data is allowed.
I'll try and give an example:
You want to give an actor a role name, but the film credits don't list one.
THIS IS NOT ALLOWED - You go to a 3rd party database and it lists one, so you use it and submit it.
THIS IS ALLOWED - You search a variety of 3rd party databases, and they all agree on the same name. You use it and submit it.
It's a bit oversimplifying the thing, but that's generally the idea. One source bad, many sources good.
Isn't this an interpretation of the rules? I've read the text I mentionned, which says "only from the DVD; Nothing from third party db"
Please can you show me exactly where in the contribution rules what you say is written? I've not seen that, but I probably missed it.
I've been flamed because I didn't want to follow EXACTLY the rules , even if they were stupid. So I need to see exactly what is written in the rules (not in the forum) concerning this subject. Surfeur: You need to keep up better. While you would be correct in a technical source. Ken and gerri have recently advised that we cannot COPY data from a third party data source, we can use them as a data refernce source (bibliography style). That said, i would not use any third party database as a SOLE reference point. I always try to obtain some form of independent corroboration, such as perhaps an actor's website or whatever depending on what I am trying to verify. I have seen occurrences where an actor's site will provide a link for, say filmography, and clicking that link takes you to another site independent of the actor's, I presume that data has been inspected and verified by the actor and thus would be willing to accept that relative to a filmography. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Ken and gerri have recently advised that we cannot COPY data from a third party data source, we can use them as a data refernce source (bibliography style).
I've not yet read that in the rules. (If you don't know them, you can find them clicking on upper right in the database page). That's really funny that people that do not stop to write "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", explain you that an interpretation which might produce ten pages of flames in this forum is good. | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
...I always try to obtain some form of independent corroboration, such as perhaps an actor's website or whatever depending on what I am trying to verify...
Skip That is also interesting. I suppose, when I see in YOUR profiles uncredited actors in the role of Stormtroopers, that you obtained independant corroboration... or perhaps you recognized them on screen captures ??? I'm very interested, for in MY profile, I suspect they come from IMDb, and I want to correct that with good information, not coming from any third party database. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,694 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Ken and gerri have recently advised that we cannot COPY data from a third party data source, we can use them as a data refernce source (bibliography style).
I've not yet read that in the rules. (If you don't know them, you can find them clicking on upper right in the database page). That's really funny that people that do not stop to write "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", explain you that an interpretation which might produce ten pages of flames in this forum is good. So what? Doesn't mean they didn't say it. In fact, I believe somebody produced the exact quote. Now shut up and quit stirring things up just because you didn't get your way before. | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964
Make America Great Again! |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote:
Now shut up ... I'll say what I want, when I want. And as said a great american "Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" ( Barry Goldwater... don't you know him ???)  | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote:
Just to clarify what Runmovies said.
The original format of "Bend of the River" was 1.37:1, the old, true Academy Ratio. That can be documented easily at TCMDB.COM - they even show a graphic representation of how it fits on the screen.
Most of the time, Academy Ratio is altered to 1.33:1 and nobody ever even makes note of it, and just lists it as Full Screen. In this case, however, the producers of the DVD remained technically correct by adding at the beginning of the movie, this statement: "This movie has been edited. It has been formatted to fit your screen." (That is a paraphrase, I didn't go back and copy it verbatim.)
Now, in DVDP we have only two way to list formats. Either in Widescreen with a ratio in the box, or as P&S with a ratio usually of 1.33. Based on the on disc presentation, I marked P&S, and entered 1.37:1 in the box. I have found, even in my local, that for some reason the ratio is still listed as 1.33. That may or may not be a bug, but that is a different discussion.
So, I am asking the two who voted NO based on the format to change their votes. I believe the way I did it is correct based on the facts, and corroborated by Runmovies' opinion as a professional projectionist. If the film is presented as 1.33:1 instead of 1.37:1, it should be listed as 1.33:1. As for the P&S designation, I believe it should be as FS. We have plenty of films originally shot as 1.85:1 that are presented as 1.78:1 and we mark those as widescreen. If we start reclassifying them as P&S, we're going to have a mess. | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting m.cellophane: Quote:
... We have plenty of films originally shot as 1.85:1 that are presented as 1.78:1 and we mark those as widescreen. If we start reclassifying them as P&S, we're going to have a mess. Pan&scan is intended to fit with classic TV screen, 1.33. So a film which is slightly cut to fit a 16/9 TV cannot be called P&S. It is to illustrate this that I took the example of McLintock!, which I find amazing... | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Ken and gerri have recently advised that we cannot COPY data from a third party data source, we can use them as a data refernce source (bibliography style).
I've not yet read that in the rules. (If you don't know them, you can find them clicking on upper right in the database page). That's really funny that people that do not stop to write "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", "the rules !!!", explain you that an interpretation which might produce ten pages of flames in this forum is good. Don't get pedantic. If Ken & Gerri said it that is enough, if you look for it you will find it right here, would I prefer that they go straight from saying it to putting it in the Rules...of course. But since it is THEIR program it i enough for them to have said it. And it is arrogant on your part to presume to say anything otherwise. Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Don't get pedantic. pe·dan·tic (p?-dan'tik) adj. Characterized by a narrow, often ostentatious concern for book learning and formal rules: a pedantic attention to details.  | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 1,777 |
| | | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 3,436 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | Achim [諾亞信； Ya-Shin//Nuo], a German in Taiwan.
Registered: May 29, 2000 (at InterVocative) |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 2,394 |
| | Posted: | | | | Here's what Ken said on June 25, 2007 about the difference between research and copying data Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
There is a difference between researching via third party sites and copying data from third party sites. Use your best judgement. To give a couple of examples:
• Checking a few online retailers to find a consensus for an upcoming DVD's release date: OK
• Copying the cast and crew (via automation or not) from the IMDB: NOT OK
| | | Another Ken (not Ken Cole)
Badges? We ain't got no badges. We don't need no badges. I don't have to show you any stinking badges.
DVD Profiler user since June 15, 2001 |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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