Quoting pplchamp:

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You cannot say without a shadow of doubt that all DVD's will have copyright informationa at the end of the credits.

That one is easy to fix in the rules. We would simply have to add the theatrical release date as a "fallback method", like this "Enter the year of the copyright date from the film credits. If no date is present, enter the theatrical release date."

Quoting pplchamp:

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For TV Shows...

Do you use Episode #1 or episode #22? Why?

What if #1 is 1982 and #22 is 1983?

Most tv seasons (in the U.S.) run from Sept to June (two different years).

I dont't understand your argument. That is exactly why the rule proposal states "Enter the year of the earliest copyright date from the episode credits in the set / on the disc." The other proposal uses the "earliest air date". So you would have to use an earliest date in any case. Whether a season spans one or two years doesn't make a difference in any case.

Quoting pplchamp:

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I say let the rules stay as they are. Why complicate things.

Using the copyright date would make things simpler (because you wouldn't have to look up third party information in at least 99% of the cases), not "more complicated". Maybe you should give it another thought, Erik.

Quoting Rifter:

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There is no good reason to use copyright date.  Copyright doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the actual date the film was made.  Copyright could just as easily be the date of the screenplay, or the date the production company was formed, or any of a dozen other things.

Do you have any proof to back up this proposition, John ? Or is this simply one of your usual "Things are like that because I say so" statements ?

Quoting Rifter:

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Now you want to change canoes in midstream and force the change of virually every profile in the database with a different date that may or may not be present in the credits of a movie or TV show.

Now that is an interesting point. It really would be interesting to see how many profiles would have to be changed. When I get home this evening I will give it a try and check the copyright date of 20 randomly picked movies against the theatrical release date. This should at least give us a hint. My guess is, at most one or two profiles would have to be changed, maybe none.

Quoting Skipnet50:

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The copyright date of a film may have absolutely nothing to do with the release date. It is not unusual for some films to sit on a shelf for years after filming in search of a distributor. I such cases the copyright date and theatrical have little or nothing in common and I would say the theatrical release(problematic, to be sure) would be the more useful.

Useful or not, Skip, the field is named "Produced" in the Profiler and "Production Year" in thr rules, not "Released" or "Release Year". So your statement "The copyright date of a film may have absolutely nothing to do with the release date" is only backing up my position.

Since we're having this discussion, your statement that "nobody gives a damn about the copyright" is obviously and proven wrong.

While it may be true that YOU only care for the theatrical release date, other's obviously have a different take on this. Calling your preference the ONLY relevant POV is .... nah, I'm sure you got my point.

I have yet to see a discussion that only concentrates on weighing the pro and con of a suggested rule change or implementation of a new rule and stays away from belittleling other users and calling their points of view inferior.

Quoting Darxon:

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I have yet to see a discussion that only concentrates on weighing the pro and con of a suggested rule change or implementation of a new rule and stays away from belittleing other users and calling their points of view inferior.

I'm talking about basic logic and common sense.  You either have it or you don't.  If the shoe fits, wear it.

Quoting Rifter:

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Quoting Darxon:

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Since we're having this discussion, your statement that "nobody gives a damn about the copyright" is obviously and proven wrong.

While it may be true that YOU only care for the theatrical release date, other's obviously have a different take on this. Calling your preference the ONLY relevant POV is .... nah, I'm sure you got my point.

I have yet to see a discussion that only concentrates on weighing the pro and con of a suggested rule change or implementation of a new rule and stays away from belittleing other users and calling their points of view inferior.

You obviously missed mine.  I said only some people here - meaning using Profiler - care about it.  The rest of the WORLD uses theatrical dates.  Take a look at ANY movie database, or ANY movie reference guide, and try to find even one that isn't organized around the theatrical release date.  It's simply ludicrous to think we are smarter than the entire world on this, especially that part of the world that MAKES the movies!

With a smirk, I state that a lot of us usually pride themselves with that notion.

Quoting Touti:

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I agreed with the copyright date at first but now I'm not so sure anymore, maybe we should stick to release date and simply ask Ken to rename the field.  As for the source of information, most DVDs if not all have the year printed somewhere on the back, there's also many online retailers that show that and there is the community here.  That should make it easy enough to find when necessary.

You got me there... I always assumed, that the date/year on the back of the cover (usually preceeded by (C)), refers to the copyright date, and not the Theatrical Release.

Learn something new every day.

Booooo, Hissssssss, public domain!!!!!!!!!!!!! Telecine, now go wash your mouth out.  

Skip

Quoting ya_shin:

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Quoting Touti:

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I agreed with the copyright date at first but now I'm not so sure anymore, maybe we should stick to release date and simply ask Ken to rename the field.  As for the source of information, most DVDs if not all have the year printed somewhere on the back, there's also many online retailers that show that and there is the community here.  That should make it easy enough to find when necessary.

You got me there... I always assumed, that the date/year on the back of the cover (usually preceeded by (C)), refers to the copyright date, and not the Theatrical Release.

Learn something new every day.

And I always assumed it's the release year but you got me thinking now.  I was not referring to the copyright date.  I noticed many times that there's a year printed on the back of a DVD, I used it a few times to compare with the packaging date to see if my copy was re-release when the cover didn't match the online db.

I'll check a few when I get home tonight, if it's the copyright date then it's no good.

Quoting Telecine:

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Copyright is an irrelevant piece of information to film lovers unless it lapses. Films then enter the public domain and have no copyright. No one anywhere in the world is interested in anything other than the release date and what year that is in relation to Awards (eg Academy Awards).

I for one am not interested in sticking a DVD in a player and finding this publicly available fact.

This represents a major departure from established processes and frankly it is too late to implement it. I can't believe that it is even being contemplated and in my view is just a navel gazing exercise being conducted a a few, divorced from real world realities.

Oooooh!  And they thought I was a hard ass!  Go get 'em, Telecine!