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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Nude Nuns with Big Guns |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | The zombie... errr... lives! Thanks Ken! | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 16, 2007 | | Posts: 280 |
| | Posted: | | | | The oversized 'S' is not a symbol; it's an artistic/typographical choice by the designer (similar to the other examples shown in the thread, such as "21 Jump Street"). It does not need to get mapped to another keyboard character because the letter it would get mapped to is 'S', the same character it already is. Therefore the rule for symbol mapping does not apply. At the same time, it's not a 'single' character. It's an artistic depiction of two separate characters from the title within the same physical space. The rules do not say "Copy only and exactly the characters physically presented on the front cover", they say "Use the title from the front cover." If it was the former, you'd end up with complications for covers that repeat/mirror/echo/etc the title text. The title of the feature is known, and if there was any uncertainty it can be verified on the spine. The text on the front cover matches that title, with a bit of artistic license for how it's drawn. To give an alternate example, suppose there was a film called "Space Wars", and it was written on the cover as: Quote:
W
Space
r
s
Where the letter 'a' is reused for both words in the title. It is only physically shown once, but it's clear that it represents that character within both of the words shown. Would you try to argue that the title should be "Space Wrs" or "Spce Wars"? Most would consider such an argument nonsensical. The only reason the current argument has any traction at all is that the singular and plural forms of the words are each valid on their own. So, the physical representation of the characters are not wholly exclusive of all other text on the cover. That is, one physical character does not necessarily represent one and only one letter within the title. In reality we should consider that we are mapping the text as shown on the cover to a character representation that is acceptable to the program, just as the cover itself is a mapping of the 'true' title into a form that's acceptable on the case cover (eg: there's a limit to the size of the font before you can't see the title on the cover anymore). Edit: And Ken answers as well. Nice | | | | Last edited: by Kinematics |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 762 |
| | | Registered: October 30, 2011 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | | Registered: May 8, 2007 | | Posts: 823 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns' Yay! Thanks! I humbly request that you try to make rulings like this more often and before these threads get so big. Anyway think about it!  | | | | 99.9% of all cat plans consist only of "Step 1." |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns' Thanks Ken...but you better be careful. You and I seem to have come up with the same answer so you might get a reputation for bending or twisting the rules.   | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
You and I seem to have come up with the same answer so you might get a reputation for bending or twisting the rules. Ken's answer was not yours. He didn't say S was a symbol. He just precised the rule, saying that shared letters should be treated as symbols are treated, which is not precised in the present rule. Thanks Ken for this precision that solves one case. I would have prefered a solution that solves all cases, I mean a modification of the rules. | | | | Images from movies | | | | Last edited: by surfeur51 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting surfeur51: Quote:
Ken's answer was not yours. He didn't say S was a symbol. Neither did I. What I said, back on page 7, was "just look at the spine in the image. The spine tells me that the large 'S' is there to represent an 'S' applying to two different words..." I went on to say, "I have no problem using the spine, or the credit block, to help me determine how that title should be entered." Is that not what Ken wrote? Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns' It sure looks like Ken and I had the same, if differently worded, answer. Or am I missing something?  While there were users that claimed it was a symbol, I was not one of them. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar | | | | Last edited: by TheMadMartian |
| | Registered: October 30, 2011 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting surfeur51:
Quote:
Ken's answer was not yours. He didn't say S was a symbol.
Neither did I. What I said, back on page 7, was "just look at the spine in the image. The spine tells me that the large 'S' is there to represent an 'S' applying to two different words..." I went on to say, "I have no problem using the spine, or the credit block, to help me determine how that title should be entered."
Is that not what Ken wrote?
Quoting Ken Cole:
Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns'
It sure looks like Ken and I had the same, if differently worded, answer. Or am I missing something?
While there were users that claimed it was a symbol, I was not one of them. You absoluetly did not And most of us that were saying symbol was becaused the shared S could not be applied to the text field which although Ken did not call it a symbol he diid did agree on the point on the text field and to check the other sources ehich happen to be in the symbol rule. I think calling it a symbol or not a symbol is just really symantecs. I think in general if the cover art rendition cannot be applied to a text field we go to the other sources for clarififcation. |
| | Registered: March 18, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,463 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns' And we had to bug the owner of the database for a decision on what was patently obvious. IMHO, the "Contributions Committee" is a joke if it couldn't resolve a simple matter such as this. | | | Thanks for your support.
Free Plugins available here.
Advanced plugins available here.
Hey, new product!!! BDPFrog. |
| | Registered: October 30, 2011 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,870 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting mediadogg: Quote:
Quoting Ken Cole:
Quote:
The S is shared between the words. Neither "Nude nun with big guns", "Nude nuns with big gun", nor "Nude nuns with big guns" is exactly what's shown on the cover, although I would say that given no other information, each of these is as valid an interpretation as the others.
Since there's no way to enter a 'shared' letter into a text field, we must pick one of the three. In this case, the spine, title screens, and credit block all agree - 'Nude Nuns with Big Guns'
And we had to bug the owner of the database for a decision on what was patently obvious. IMHO, the "Contributions Committee" is a joke if it couldn't resolve a simple matter such as this. Well this forum is not really a commitee. But several here came to this decision in fact Martians wording was very similar. The mian problem was the OP refused to accept the idea. |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting mediadogg: Quote:
And we had to bug the owner of the database for a decision on what was patently obvious. The problem is not the title of this movie. The movie title is also the title of the thread and so was obvious from the beginning. The real question is : do we apply for the online rules strictly, even if we get stupid data (that is what 80% of users want), or do we introduce in rules a sentence that states that correct information is what we want. Unfortunately, Ken wrote that, yes, in this case, we are autorized to be intelligent, but modified nothing in the rules. So we'll continue to have discussions about odd cases with odd solutions, as the thread about 3D in title that began yesterday. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 18, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,463 |
| | Posted: | | | | Yes, I know. I'm just a little bummed that we spent all this work for something like this, yet the now infamous and totally dead "Gold Profiles" project sits with Tasks nobody has signed up to do ... after all that fanfare and even approval from Ken. No worries, it's my own hurt ego problem ... | | | Thanks for your support.
Free Plugins available here.
Advanced plugins available here.
Hey, new product!!! BDPFrog. | | | | Last edited: by mediadogg |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | As usual surfeit is deliberately misreading the rules for his own agenda and to try and spark more controversy. I will wager the credit block title will solve the issue. Sometimg that is allowed under the rules, and it will no doubt show two s. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting mediadogg: Quote:
And we had to bug the owner of the database for a decision on what was patently obvious. IMHO, the "Contributions Committee" is a joke if it couldn't resolve a simple matter such as this. We didn't have to bug the owner as the answer was quite simple. The problem is, some users, for reasons only they know, didn't want to accept that simple answer. Yes, there are areas, in the rules, that require us to reproduce errors...cast, crew, overview, etc...but the Title field is not one of them. Because we have to take the title from the front of the case, an area where it is usually presented in a stylized manner, surrounded with artwork and other text, the title will always need to be interpreted. That is why, in my opinion, the rules do not require us to copy it exactly. Whenever there has been a question about the title, I have always looked to the spine. So, while I didn't need Ken to tell me how to do it, I am relieved to know that I have been doing it right all these years. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: May 29, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,475 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting mediadogg: Quote:
Yes, I know. I'm just a little bummed that we spent all this work for something like this, yet the now infamous and totally dead "Gold Profiles" project sits with Tasks nobody has signed up to do ... after all that fanfare and even approval from Ken. No worries, it's my own hurt ego problem ... Don't get discouraged - this time of the year is a busy one. As for myself, my mother is scheduled for heart surgery and I will be leaving for Florida on Monday to be with her throughout. I don't have a return date scheduled yet, I'm thinking a month or so, but when I return I will be happy to get to work helping with this project. | | | | Last edited: by Kathy |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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