| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 |  Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | There is an actor listed on IMDB (and several other online movie websites) as Robert Lewis Bush, who is credited as appearing in 6 movies as an actor. First 2 movies in 1980 ("Urban Cowboy" and "The Elephant Man"), and then later 4 other movies from 1993 to 1998 ("Body Bags", "In the Mouth of Madness", "Village of the Damned" and "Vampires" - all of them directed by John Carpenter). IMDB lists his aliases as Robert Bush and Robert L. Bush.
The Credit Lookup Tool also shows that the actor with these 3 name variants shows up in these 6 movies.
I have now personally verified his credits in all these 6 movies. They are as follows:
Robert L. Bush (3 movies):
- Body Bags
- Village of the Damned
- Vampires/John Carpenter's Vampires
Robert Bush (2 movies):
- Urban Cowboy
- The Elephant Man
Robert Lewis Bush (1 movie):
- In the Mouth of Madness
Am I wrong in thinking that the correct Common Name for this actor should be Robert L. Bush and not Robert Lewis Bush (as it seems to be now), since this is how he is most often credited in his movies? | | | | Last edited: by Behemot |
|
| Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 6,730 |
| | Posted: | | | | You would be right, provided you'd find any proof outside of IMDB that these three are identical. HP of Mr. Bush would be best, second best a WhoIsWho entry, a fine thing too is Wikipedia provided they don't crossrefer to what ... correct IMDB. EDIT: For further information on what is a common name and when to apply read here and don't get too confused, the discussion is still in progress. | | | It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?
Registrant since 05/22/2003 | | | | Last edited: by Lewis_Prothero |
|
| Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Behemot:
Do we KNOW that we are talking about the same person. It is not inconceivable for them to be different people with similar names. The first thing I would do is try to establish reasonably that al three are the same, perhaps via Screen Cap comparisons. You are talking about, right off the top of my head, about a 20 year spread of films there I think. Perhaps Robert Bush is Daddy and Robert L is sonny boy.
That is always my first step, verify that they are the same.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
|
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | I'm fairly sure that at least Robert L. Bush and Robert Lewis Bush are the same person, but I have no idea if Robert Bush is the same guy, other than his listings on IMDB and several other websites. I'll try and get some screen caps! | | | | Last edited: by Behemot |
|
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,759 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting goblinsdoitall: Quote:
You would be right, provided you'd find any proof outside of IMDB that these three are identical.
HP of Mr. Bush would be best, second best a WhoIsWho entry, a fine thing too is Wikipedia provided they don't crossrefer to what ... correct IMDB. IMDb may be fine for documenting that those name variants belong to the same person, specially because this actor has worked under the same director for different films. Directors tend to rehire actors if they are happy with their work. |
|
| Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,730 |
| | Posted: | | | | Just like you said "may be" but doesn't have to. IMDB as a commercial database always has to considered as a hint. What I wanted to say is that you don't necessarily have found two sources if you use a site outside the personal environment of the actor in question and e.g. IMDB (or any other site). Three sites crossrefering each other on a possibly false information don't make the information true. And as was written in this thread IMDB puts in false information to check whether their information got copied. | | | It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?
Registrant since 05/22/2003 |
|
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | I agree with Goblin. I don't trust them as a sole source of ANY data. A starting point and maybe a pointer rto something else or to serve in conjunction with other references fine, but not alone.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
|
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | | | | | Last edited: by Behemot |
|
| Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 585 |
| | Posted: | | | | I've got Urban Cowboy so I can check it later tonight if someone doesn't get a chance before me. | | | "Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men" - Douglas Bader
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams |
|
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Vega: Quote:
I've got Urban Cowboy so I can check it later tonight if someone doesn't get a chance before me. Thanks! |
|
| Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 585 |
| | Posted: | | | | Okay, I don't know if this is going to help any. I think we might be looking at 3 different actors here. Dwight 1Dwight 2-edit- Well, assuming the Elephant Man screencap is correct that is. I noticed in the EM credits there's a Milkman, a Porter, and Cabman and just looking at tha screencap, that guy really could be any one of them. I guess you would know better knowing the context of the scene, but if he's the messenger it's definitely a different guy. "Dwight" doesn't speak in his brief 3 second appearance so it's possible he's English, but he sure doesn't look it. Also, the nose doesn't look even remotely close compared to the EM guy. I find it strange that the 2 movies both comes out in 1980 with same named actors who are different guys, but it's always possible. Especially since I don't believe England cares or participates with the whole SAG thing and keeping everyone's names unique, so anything is possible I suppose. Maybe someone who has John Carpenter's Vampires could look for the TV News Anchor in the movie and shed a little more light on this guy. | | | "Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men" - Douglas Bader
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams | | | | Last edited: by Vega |
|
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Vega: Quote:
Okay, I don't know if this is going to help any. I think we might be looking at 3 different actors here.
Dwight 1
Dwight 2
-edit-
Well, assuming the Elephant Man screencap is correct that is. I noticed in the EM credits there's a Milkman, a Porter, and Cabman and just looking at tha screencap, that guy really could be any one of them. I guess you would know better knowing the context of the scene, but if he's the messenger it's definitely a different guy. "Dwight" doesn't speak in his brief 3 second appearance so it's possible he's English, but he sure doesn't look it. Also, the nose doesn't look even remotely close compared to the EM guy. I find it strange that the 2 movies both comes out in 1980 with same named actors who are different guys, but it's always possible. Especially since I don't believe England cares or participates with the whole SAG thing and keeping everyone's names unique, so anything is possible I suppose.
Maybe someone who has John Carpenter's Vampires could look for the TV News Anchor in the movie and shed a little more light on this guy. I've watched through "The Elephant Man" again, and done some Google searches, and the young guy I thought was Robert Bush in my previous post is in fact an actor called Tony London. This, however, is a boy who appears early in the movie when Anthony Hopkins is in surgery, knocking on the door and delivering a message that he's found the elephant man's whereabouts: http://img143.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=th_89627_Elephant0_122_1103lo.jpgI found the movie's screenplay here: http://andrew.suso.org/extras/script_library/scripts/microsoft_word_scripts/ElephantMan.docThe screenplay describes the character pictured above like this: Quote:
A hospital MESSENGER BOY, dressed in a blue uniform and a
can is making his way down the hall. I am now sure that the picture of the boy is Robert Bush of "The Elephant Man". This means that there are 2 different actors called Robert Bush (no birth years available, unfortunately) and another different actor called Robert L. Bush (credited 3 times with this name and once as Robert Lewis Bush.) I've also watched through "John Carpenter's Vampires" and couldn't find anyone who was a "TV News Anchor". | | | | Last edited: by Behemot |
|
| Registered: August 22, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,807 |
| | Posted: | | | | I don't know if this helps, but http://www.inbaseline.com/person.aspx?person_id=228613 Robert Bush AKAs Robert Lewis Bush [...] BTW, they claim that Quote:
Every piece of information we enter into our database is confirmed or verified by an in-house researcher. We adhere to strict editorial guidelines that have been in place since Baseline's inception 20 years ago. | | | | -- Enry |
|
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Hmmm, interesting resource, I am going to have to look into that some more.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
|
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 188 |
| | Posted: | | | | I find that filmographies are an excellent source of deciding which actor is the same as another. IMDb is ONE such listing. I am perfectly content with that plus one or two more that state clearly that "this same actor" appeared in "these same films". Show me two or three filmography links and that's decent documentation for me. | | | | Build a man a fire and you keep him warm for a day. Set a man on fire and you keep him warm the rest of his life. |
|
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 555 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting EnryWiki: Quote:
I don't know if this helps, but
http://www.inbaseline.com/person.aspx?person_id=228613
Robert Bush
AKAs Robert Lewis Bush
[...]
BTW, they claim that
Quote:
Every piece of information we enter into our database is confirmed or verified by an in-house researcher. We adhere to strict editorial guidelines that have been in place since Baseline's inception 20 years ago. Well, in this case it seems they must be wrong, as we are clearly dealing with 3 different actors here (see screen caps posted earlier). IMDB lists Robert Lewis Bush as being credited as Robert Bush for his work in the Costume and Wardrobe Department, BTW; according to IMDB he's been a costumer for 4 of John Carpenter's movies, 2 of which he also appears in very briefly as an actor. This might explain why actor/costumer Robert Lewis Bush (to use his full name) has been mistaken with the actors called Robert Bush appearing in The Elephant Man and Urban Cowboy. My guess is that most online movie databases use IMDB as a source, so it's no wonder this error has been propagated. |
|