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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Are Uncredited Cast names cloned from IMDB ?? |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,494 |
| | Posted: | | | | This has probably been hashed over before in the forums, but please refresh my memory on this topic.
Are the long list of uncredited names that are currently in Invelos data cast files culled from IMDB ?
It would appear to me that they are, as first of all : The names are not in the closing credits of the film in question and also the idea of where IMDB has a 'member' log-in feature of which if you know of a family member (or yourself for that matter) you can have IMDB place your invitation of that uncredited name and role ( if any) to be placed in the ranks of their casting section.
Quite often I will notice that the exact same names in order and the same spelling as well as the funny type role they played ( i.e. Man with cigar on Bench) seems to me a ripoff of that data.
thoughts??? | | | In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.
Terry |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 5,459 |
| | Posted: | | | | I believe that if the uncredited cast were a copy of the IMDB data and had been added to the profile after a certain date then we were allowed to remove them. Can't remember the date though...
To be honest I think uncredited cast is more useful to log cameos rather than the glorified extras that seem to inhabit most profiles. |
| | Registered: June 12, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 2,665 |
| | Posted: | | | | Not all long lists are clones, just most of them. I concur with Northbloke's usage of uncredited. Cameo's and early roles for people who later became famous is more interesting than the "glorified extras". But i'll take anyone you can document.
I'm just submitted a contribution that removes a long uncredited list (21 names) that, except for one word, is a perfect match for IMDb's Uncredited list.
I've Googled a number of them and can find nothing except other movie sites that appear to be reflections of the IMDb data. Nothing i'd believe as independent (a good fan site, a personal page, etc.) can be found to support the data. I don't need to prove they are a copy of IMDb, that's pretty obvious. The question is how much proof do you need to remove an obvious IMDb clone. I don't think the bar is as high to remove as to add uncredited.
Maybe it was justified in the Intervocative days but i don't have access to that history. I'll see what the voters say (Mark of Zorro - 1940). | | | | Bad movie? You're soaking in it! |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Posts: 1,982 |
| | Posted: | | | | The only time that I put uncredit cast in my contribution is when I'm 100% sure of it. I recognize them (by example when I contribute an adult DVD), iit is said in the audio commentary or it's a well known fact (example Lucio Fulcio in the majority of his movie) but this one is almost like the first it's a eyes hunting game(?). If I find something who clearly came from IMDB I remove it from my personal database, but I don't submit the change because at one time this was accept (way before my time). |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 3,197 |
| | Posted: | | | | It's typical for old movies to have a long list of uncredited actors, because in those days only the stars got a credit, typically in the front titles (end titles was also a rarity). I don't think simply removing them without documentation adds any value to the database. Yes, maybe they were copied from IMDb at some point in the past, but does that make the data invalid? I think Ken needs to decide on this. | | | | First registered: February 15, 2002 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 4,596 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Patsa: Quote:
It's typical for old movies to have a long list of uncredited actors, because in those days only the stars got a credit, typically in the front titles (end titles was also a rarity). I don't think simply removing them without documentation adds any value to the database. Yes, maybe they were copied from IMDb at some point in the past, but does that make the data invalid? I think Ken needs to decide on this. Ken has already decided on this in this thread | | | | My WebGenDVD online Collection |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | yes Ken has made a decision on this already.. what it boils down to is if it is an exact copy of IMDB then they are to be removed. | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,694 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Patsa: Quote:
It's typical for old movies to have a long list of uncredited actors, because in those days only the stars got a credit, typically in the front titles (end titles was also a rarity). I don't think simply removing them without documentation adds any value to the database. Yes, maybe they were copied from IMDb at some point in the past, but does that make the data invalid? I think Ken needs to decide on this. Of course, in those old movies, the same can be said that HAVING all those uncredited doesn't add any value, since documenting all but a very, very few is virtually impossible. Its similar to hauling around boxes of junk whenever you move, that just sits there and never gets unpacked, only to move with you again the next time you move. Plus, the chance that they came from someplace OTHER THAN IMDB is next to impossible. | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964
Make America Great Again! |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,494 |
| | Posted: | | | | I thought I remembered seeing this in the forums ( May 2007 ).,
I personally hate the uncredited as I perfer the credits to be exact On screen credits.
and as Patsa said earlier that post screen credits are a rarity, and I don't believe there were used until an agreement in the 60's (70's?) with the actors guild and their Unions. | | | In the 60's, People took Acid to make the world Weird. Now the World is weird and People take Prozac to make it Normal.
Terry | | | | Last edited: by widescreenforever |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,197 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Rifter: Quote:
Of course, in those old movies, the same can be said that HAVING all those uncredited doesn't add any value, since documenting all but a very, very few is virtually impossible. Its similar to hauling around boxes of junk whenever you move, that just sits there and never gets unpacked, only to move with you again the next time you move. Plus, the chance that they came from someplace OTHER THAN IMDB is next to impossible. Maybe they are not of value to you, but for many interested in classic movies they are. And there are many books dealing with the subject where you can get documentation for uncredited actors. Not to mention people still alive who were actually there and worked on the movies. Where do you think IMDb got their information from? | | | | First registered: February 15, 2002 | | | | Last edited: by Nexus the Sixth |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 951 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
If you believe the uncredited entries are a carbon copy of a third party source, and the existing contribution note history doesn't supply a source, you may remove them, but are not required to do so. I would add before you go on a crusade of wholesale removal of Uncredited entries that you believe come from a third party source. You might want to take the time to verify if they are actually in the movie. If they are, all you may need to do is update the role to match more closely to those of the credited cast. | | | Are you local?
This is a local shop the strangers you would bring would not understand us, our customs, our local ways. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 2,694 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Patsa: Quote:
Quoting Rifter:
Quote:
Of course, in those old movies, the same can be said that HAVING all those uncredited doesn't add any value, since documenting all but a very, very few is virtually impossible. Its similar to hauling around boxes of junk whenever you move, that just sits there and never gets unpacked, only to move with you again the next time you move. Plus, the chance that they came from someplace OTHER THAN IMDB is next to impossible.
Maybe they are not of value to you, but for many interested in classic movies they are. And there are many books dealing with the subject where you can get documentation for uncredited actors. Not to mention people still alive who were actually there and worked on the movies. Where do you think IMDb got their information from? From a bunch of fools who dumped a lot of crap willy nilly into the database without any standards or proof. If there WAS proof, those people would long since have gotten the credit that was due them. In any case, it still remains that 98% of them CAN'T be documented and never will be, so why in hell are we hauling them around? | | | John
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice!" Senator Barry Goldwater, 1964
Make America Great Again! |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,197 |
| | Posted: | | | | And now a bunch of fools will remove them without any standards or proof. | | | | First registered: February 15, 2002 |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 4,596 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Patsa: Quote:
And now a bunch of fools will remove them without any standards or proof. Don't need standards or proof. According to Ken if they're IMDb clones (identical), they're gone. Or are you insinuating that Ken is a fool?   | | | | My WebGenDVD online Collection |
| | Registered: August 22, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 1,807 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting 8ballMax: Quote:
Quoting Patsa:
Quote:
And now a bunch of fools will remove them without any standards or proof.
Don't need standards or proof. According to Ken if they're IMDb clones (identical), they're gone.
I think that the key word in what Ken said is "copy". If the "Uncredited" entries were documented in the contribution notes, say with a time stamp or else, it's not a "copy", even if the uncredited credits happen to be identical to those in another database because both databases happen to be accurate once in a while!  Am I wrong? | | | | -- Enry |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | That applies now, Enry, and has applied for two years. i have a basic problem with summarily removing which is pre July 2005 as determined by release date. That date is not arbitrary, it is when Ken said don't use IMDb even for (uncredited).
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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